Load design problem

Hi

I have a “weird” problem with the design process. Here is my setup:

Server: Domino 8.5 HF1

Server: Mail Files are on 8.0.2

Clients: Notes 8.0.2 + 8.5

I have made some changes to my (already customized) 8.0.2 mail template. I try and load the update by entering “Load Design” in the server console and thought that the updates would then be in everybody’s mail file. Unfortunately this is not the case. I then assumed that the template name was incorrect - also not the case (even the language was correct). I then opened a single mail file and did a “update design” from the notes client - low and behold it worked. I can update the mail files using the Notes Client (with a refresh and not a replace) but not using the “Load Design -f mail\xyz.nsf” command. Another odd thing is that my “ndesign” program document also no longer works (the load design command does start, no updates are applied) - I then added the design process to the ServerTasksAt1 notes.ini variable and this does work. Huh?

Anybody have any idea what is happening here?

Thanking you in advance

Ursus Schneider

Subject: Support

Hi

I have reported this to IBM Support and have been told that I will receive a hotfix to fix this problem.

As soon as I have received the hotfix and installed it I will post here to let you know if it fixes the problem

Thank you very much for any help given :o)

Ursus

Subject: no resolution

unfortunatly IBM does not have a solution specifically for my problem - we have to wait for 8.5.1 where the problem has been solved :o(

Subject: Update Following IBM Tech Support Discussion

I just wanted to post an update here on what our experience has been. We got in touch with IBM support folks and did a bunch of investigation.

The IBM tech found that our issue was similar to the one recorded in SPR JDEP7RHNBK and they are going to put together a hotfix for us and send it to us for application. Once we get it in place, I will post our results.

Subject: Still Working This Issue

We have continued working with IBM Tech Support on this issue but haven’t found a solution yet. The fight continues, though! :slight_smile:

Subject: SPR Assigned and Hotfix Being Built

We were assigned an SPR for our issue (SPR #JDEP7V3SV5) and they are currently building a hotfix for our environment. We expect to get the hotfix next week and I will post results when we get them.

Subject: i have also had this problem

I have given up using the design -f command, as it does not apply template changes on 8.5 server, and now use design refresh on the client.

Subject: load convert

Hi there

I am having the exact same problem…seriously, I had to double check the dates as even the dates were close. Anyway load convert works, but I can’t find any reason why the load design only works the first time. If you change the inherit design from property in the mail db to another copy of the template, then it works,once.

Subject: Prohibit design refresh

I am also running 8.5 on the servers, and I have 6.5, 7 and 8.5 on my machine which I am busy conducting tests with.

Ok this is strange. I want you to please try and do the same to see if you get the same result.

The design task works once after being assigned a new database. After that it is almost like the db (mail\xyz.nsf) design elements have prohibit design refresh enabled. If you then open mail\xyz.nsf and select the prohibit design refresh on ANY design element and then remove it again, the next time design runs it is working fine…

Subject: Change anything in the dest db…

not only the inheret design att, and the load design will work…once.

Subject: problem still occurs in 8.5.1

"load design -f dbname.nsf "does not update the design of a single element that I change, and so I need to use the client Design Refresh.

Subject: ‘load design’ issues

Some more info on this:The output on the Server console is as follows when I do a ‘load design’:

(date and time) Database Designer started

(database name)

DestNonDataModified Time: (date and time)

DatabaseDesignModifierTime: (date and time)

DestIconModifierTIme: (date and time)

DestRefreshDesignModTime: (date and time)

DatabaseTemplateTime: (date and time)

Context.SrcDesignTime: (date and time)

(date and time) Database Designer shutdown

This all happens instantly and is not shown in the log file, only on the console.

The log file just shows:

11/04/2009 11:15:16 AM Database Designer started

11/04/2009 11:15:17 AM Database Designer shutdown

Subject: ‘load design’ issues resolved

This has resolved itself with the Domino version 8.5.1 !!!

Subject: ‘load design’ issues

Has this ever been resolved? I am getting the same as Ursus when I do a load design on databases. They are not mail databases…:

DestNonDataModifiedTime: 20.05.2009 13:59:16

DatabaseDesignModifiedTime: 20.05.2009 13:59:16

DestIconModifiedTime: 06.10.2008 18:18:36

DestRefreshDesignModTime: 05.02.2009 02:01:51

DatabaseTemplateTime: 04.02.2009 11:54:04

Context.SrcDesignTime: 20.05.2009 10:55:44

Individual design replace from the client works… just not the ‘load design…’ from the console…

Subject: Log output?

When you do the manual “load design” command, is there any console output at all? What does it say?

Subject: log output

Hi Ben

wow - thank you for the quick response…

Yeah, that’s also a bit “funny”. In the log.nsf file I am getting the usual lines (which databases have been updated etc.) except that the mail files are NOT being updated. On the server console I am getting the following:

user Name here

DestNonDataModifiedTime: 20.05.2009 13:59:16

DatabaseDesignModifiedTime: 20.05.2009 13:59:16

DestIconModifiedTime: 06.10.2008 18:18:36

DestRefreshDesignModTime: 05.02.2009 02:01:51

DatabaseTemplateTime: 04.02.2009 11:54:04

Context.SrcDesignTime: 20.05.2009 10:55:44

for each mail database (funnily enough not the others?).

To be 100% clear - these lines are NOT making it to the log.nsf but ARE being displayed in the console?

I have searched for the individual word (DestNonDataModifiedTime etc.) but could not find out anything - why is this coming all of a sudden, does it have any relevance (I assume so).

Thanks again

Ursus

Subject: Check Clocks

I’ve seen that console output before and have assumed (total guesswork) that this is indicating that the design elements in the .nsf are actually newer than those in the .ntf - I could be wrong here.

As the database is newer, there is nothing to do.

Check the date/time on all the machines concerned. Are they correct?

Edit: Once that is checked, check the date/time of a design element in one of the affected mailfiles, like the Memo form. Is it the same or different to the template? Older or newer?

Subject: time stamps perfect

Hi Ben

checked and double checked that already :o)

The date/time on the server is the same as that of the client. The design elements are newer on template (20.05.2009) than on the mail file (23.10.2008) so that cannot be it either.

The lines in the console have appeared since Notes 8.5 - this seems to be “normal” - a work colleague also has the same on a new server that he just installed.

Any other ideas?

Thanks

Ursus

Subject: Some Avenues For Investigation

We recently experienced this same problem and it brought to mind some experiences we had back in February. I don’t have exact details as the order of things was lost; however, we are going to pursue this and see if we can’t determine exact steps to duplicate the problem and we were able to fix/avoid the issue and that might help you.

Back in February, we were working with a client who had Domino R6.5.5FP3 servers and we were doing development with both Notes R8.0.1/2 and R8.5 Designer clients. All three flavors of Notes R8 Designer clients touched the design of some templates we were rolling out to the client’s production servers. However, once the templates were on the production servers, we were unable to create databases based on those templates, although I do not recall the specific error messages that we got (sorry about that).

Just this week, we were updating templates with a Notes R8.0.2 Designer client where the templates had been created as new copies of other templates by using a Notes R8.5 client. When we ran the Design task, the updated design elements in the template were not updated into the databases based on that template. When we selected a specific database and then refreshed the design through the menu, we occasionally got updates pushed to the databases, but not reliably. Similar behavior was observed using the “load design -f ” from the server command line.

In both cases, we fixed/avoided the issue by creating a new copy of the template using a Notes R8.0.2 client. The templates in both of our issues had been copied using a Notes R8.5 client (using New Copy). This morning, after using a Notes R8.0.2 client to create a new copy of the affected template, we ran the Design process against the entire server and all of the databases based on that template were updated as expected.

Something of note was that when the database designs were updated from the new copy of the template, two new design elements were added:

05/27/2009 08:45:10 Updating ‘build.properties’ into database ‘Client Chart 41’ from template ‘Client Portal Template’

05/27/2009 08:45:11 Updating ‘.project’ into database ‘Client Chart 41’ from template ‘Client Portal Template’

I don’t understand why these templates behave this way, it is counter-intuitive to me and it might be that I am missing something. Unfortunately, we didn’t track enough of the details to document the entire process, I am going to need to start from scratch and document each step and run multiple tests to try to duplicate and document this issue.

Good luck! I’ll be interested to hear of making new copies of the templates with an R8.0.2 client help.

Subject: Oops

Hello

sorry, somehow I missed your response :o(

I have done exactly as you stated - I created a new copy of the template using the 8.0.2 client. I then did a load design and quite a few of the databases where changed (I cannot tell for sure if ALL of them where, although it did seem so). This makes sense to me as the documents (forms, views etc) in the new template all have a new date and must therefore be updated. So far so good. I then updated a single form in the database - I started load design again and was expecting the form to be replaced in each and every database - this was NOT the case. What happened was that SOME databases got the new form, others quite simply didn’t get the update at all. Even running the update design task a couple of times has not helped!

I think that this might be a bug in 8.5?

Thank you again for you help, any further ideas?

Greetings from warm Austria (Mozart, not kangaroos :o)

Ursus