I am considering Linux for my next upgrade. But the licensing is no easier to understand than M$. I don’t want to move off of Windows2000 server unless the cost is considerably less. As I understand I would no longer need to pay for M$ CAL’s because no CAL’s exist in Linux. But, SUSE costs $500 this is not enough saving to justify moving form M$. It seems they also want the $500 times each server you install. Which Linux systems are supported is also a hot topic on this forum. RedHat (7.2?ES?AS?desktop?) SUSE (standard? enterprise?) What I am trying to do is build several cheap 20 user Domino systems.
Subject: Linux License Cost
Most of the time the money that you are looking at paying for to conpanies like SuSE or Red Hat are for support. Also, from what I know of Red Hat ES and AS, they are tuning the kernel differently and adding different software for those versions. I currently have a test system running RH9 (Free download) and Domino 6.0.3. I have had not issues with performance. I get linux support from the linux community. I would suggest setting up a test environment with whatever freely downloaded version of linux you can get. I haven’t tried Fedora, but that is my next test.
Subject: RE: Linux License Cost
For testing we have loaded 3 separate Domino 6.5 servers on Slackware. They run like champs!
Just don’t expect support from IBM.
Subject: RE: Linux License Cost
I have it running on Red Hat 7.3, but I am also trying to get it to run on the Mandrake 9 series.
All in all I would say it is worth the effort to be running on Linux just from the stand point that I can have longer uptimes without the memory leaks.
The only reason I would not recommend the Linux OS is if you are using 3rd party products which can only run on M$ os’es.
Lastly to the comment of having support from the Linux vendors… I think it is good if you are bleeding cutting edge in the hardware. But if you have standard equipment then SuSE will not anything which would help with support for running the Lotus/IBM software.
HTH – Cheers
Subject: Now SuSe
My guess with SuSe it is Standard server8. At 450.00 That’s getting pretty high also. But it is supported by Lotus/IBM. Seems like I should have thorough support for a mission critical server. Maybe not…
Can the desktop version run Domino. Seems to run OK on Window2000 Professional.
Where can I purchase Linux cheaper. Other than shrink wrap?
Subject: Linux License Cost
We’ve been running Domino 6 on Red Hat 8 since about last March, we converted from NT4 and would never go back. It was only supported on RH 7.2, I believe, but it works fine on RH8. Try a couple of installs, maybe try RH9 or Fedora if you don’t want to spent the money on RHES.
I did talk to IBM and the other person was right, don’t expect support from IBM if you put it on an unsupported OS, but our 3rd party vendor is an IBM partner and they support us just fine when we need it. They even helped us with the migration from NT4 to Linux.
Subject: Linux License Cost
You can download Linux without paying any License cost.
Somebody already mentioned, I’d like to repeat: They charge for the CD shipping and for support/service, not for the license, because Linux’ license wouldn’t allow to SELL LINUX, it allows to sell the CDs and earn money for compiling a special “Linux distribution” such as RedHat, SuSE or debian (which is also sold on CDs for a few bucks, just to get back the costs for creating the CDs)
Afaik, the license requires that the distribution must be available for download. You can download all the RedHat CDs and install it for yourself.
What you will be charged for is support and (RedHet) for a “windowsupdate”-like maintenance tool (up2date).
I downloaded RedHat 7.2 and managed to install Domino (5.0.10) on that machine. It’s running perfectly.
I suggest you save the money for the RedHat distros and go to a Linux Administration Training instead!
If you’re too short of time, you should stick on the system you already have, because learning to administer a Linux server WILL take time.
Subject: Let’s Talk RedHat
Ok… We have WS, ES and AS.
AS: is supported by Lotus/IBM as I understand. But its way to expensive.
ES: Would i use basic or standard? Standard is to pricy also.
WS: Would i use basic or standard? These are both very affordable.
Subject: RE: Let’s Talk RedHat
If you are going to go with a distro that is not supported by Lotus/IBM,the question arises as to whether you want Linux support or not.If you are confident in your Linux abilities and the ability to find almost all answers to Linux problems from the community at large, go with Fedora, Slackware, or another form of freely downloaded Linux.
Subject: Linux License Cost
The company I work for used to use RedHat Linux as our primary OS for our notes/domino servers.
Unfortinately, thanks to Lotus’s arcane and stupid OS support policies, they have dropped all support for the free versions of Linux. In otherwords, to even get the server to RUN on Linux, you need to spend over $500 us, per server. Domino will not even run on RedHat 9.0.
We ordered some new Dell servers which only supported Windows, RedHat 9.0, and RedHat advanced Server. Domino crashed on RedHat 9.0, RedHat 8,0 refused to install on the servers, and RedHat advanced server cost more than Windows 2000 Server (!!! are they out of their minds???)
We basically said screw it to the whole damn mess and installed Windows 2000 Professional and put domino on that. Techically speaking, Lotus doesn’t support it (surprise, surprise), but other than some high-end support (>2 processors) there is no difference between Pro and Server when it comes to Application Server Hosting (ie/ domino). In fact, the only difference is a few characters in a text file that the Windows Installer reads during the installation 
Any B.S. Lotus gives you about Domino/Notes server not running on Windows 2000 Professional is a lie - it works exactially the same as Windows 2000 Server. The only difference is the people at the support line won’t help you. But if they’re exactially the same (except for a few logos such as the one on the start menu), how are they going to know?
~$200 for Windows 2000 Pro is a LOT cheaper than spending >$1000 for a “server” OS such as Windows 2000 Server or RedHat AS 2.1. IBM and Lotus are basically pulling support for every free version of linux (ie/ wont even install).
The whole point to Linux is that it’s cheaper. If that’s the case - why does it cost more than Windows? Can someone explain that to me?
Subject: That’s the way I see it
Or, Is this idea workable. If I purchase one shrink wrap supported version of RedHat 7.2 Standard Edition at $800.00. Can I then install that OS on subsequent servers (unsupported) at no cost. This would most definately make a cheaper than M$ at $800.00 for each server. I probably wouldn’t need RedHat support after I gain some experience. Espesially if I am consistant with my hardware builds.
Subject: RE: Linux License Cost
There extensive discussion here on getting Domino to run on RedHat 9.0. If you’re willing to run unsupported on Win2K, why not RedHat, too?
Subject: Linux License Cost
Not to discourage anyone from moving off MS OS’s, but you shouldn’t need to be paying for MS CALs on a Domino server. This has been covered about a billion times. It’s not necessary to pay Microsoft CALs for a server where those clients only access Domino services.
That being said, there are a lot of other reasons to move to Linux, not the least of which is lack of vulnerability to all those Windows worms.
Subject: How did CALs get into the thread?
Subject: RE: How did CALs get into the thread?
Take a look at the original posting (main document). CALs (or the lack thereof) played at least a part in the decision to look at Linux. Nathan doesn’t just make this stuff up, you know.
Subject: Well, not this time, anyway.
Subject: RE: Well, not this time, anyway.
True – I did not see the CAL statement originally.
Subject: RE: How did CALs get into the thread?
Original post said “As I understand I would no longer need to pay for M$ CAL’s because no CAL’s exist in Linux.”
This would suggest he believes he currently does need to pay MS CALs.
Subject: Linux License Cost
It’s not worth spending money for suse. i recommand installing Debian linux. it’s really the most professional distrib (used internally by hp and many others).however you won’t have support from ibm (what a stupid policy), so you can install a redhat 7x on a separate partition and have it ready if you need ibm support (from experience they are helpless).
Subject: RE: Linux License Cost
True - there is no official support from IBM, but I can really recommend Debian 3.0 (currently Woody).
Actually I’m now running 6.5 on Debian Linux on a Dell SMP machine.
Direct benefits:
-
No license costs for Debian (even not in the future!)
-
a rock solid software package management system (*.deb)
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- far superior to the *.rpm based systems, cause the system really knows about dependencies
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the Debian community addresses security patches usually really fast
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stabililty is a top goal to reach
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…
Downside (to be honest)
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Not the latest gimmicks run directly on the system, 'cause every commecial package is usually in rpm format.
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- using the alien packaging system, you can convert packages to *.deb format
If you plan to run Domino 6.5 on Debian 3.0 soon, please search this forum for postings on Debian and Domino 6.5. People help each other here and on the net to solve problems.
Once you get used to the Linux Debian way of doing things, you’ll be happy about the uptime of theses systems and their reliability.
Just another opinion,
Uwe (recommending Debian)